Locate Teacher update and notes from 3/18/17 gathering

[fr3y]

Ok it was an eye-opening night for me personally, I was hoping to conduct some experiments but had come to the conclusion earlier in the day that using drain self as a primary filter was unnecessarily complicating things. In my scramble to have something new ready for the meeting I made the poor choice of choosing something even more complicated and as a result was ill-prepared.
Thanks to Lace and Coraal for being the only starting attendees. I can't say the start of the meeting bore much fruit, but it did allow me to realize that my new direction wasn't worth attempting either. Then Arnaya and Black Lotus showed and it was decided to forego the experiments and discuss potential methods regarding the Art. I'll post the minutes from that point on.
Basically it was a night of learning, for me at least.

Our next meeting is on the 22nd at 8pm in provenance and we now have some definite ideas to pursue. Anyone with ideas is welcome to attend.

3/18/2017
Frey: let's use the rest of the time to get some individual input on the art in general
Coraal nods and makes a few more notes
Arnaya nods in understanding to Frey
Frey: it would probably be the wisest use of time until i get the details squared away.
Frey: lotus had an idea concerning detecting the teachers focus
Arnaya: What sort of input did you need, Frey hun?
Frey: any and all
Frey: what was your idea again lotus ?
Frey: i think it was that it would automatically detect teachers of our own focus
Black-Lotus: I was saying that if you found the need to have an art focus on multiple halos, and the need for it to be able to tell the focus, you should have the art simply work based on the focus of the user.
Black-Lotus: The output of dreamsoul from the user of the art, would be more than enough to find similar outputs.
Frey: thats right.. does anyone have thoughts ?
Black-Lotus: In the initial notes it was said that knowing what focus of the teachers would be more important to the newly awakened.
Black-Lotus: If that is the case, finding teachers of their own focus would be the greater need.
Arnaya: It's not a bad idea, but there's a lot that teachers of other focus can help with as well... most of my teachers for example arn't of my focus, as one example
Black-Lotus: Now, if you wanted to take it a step further, you would look at Sense Dreamers.
Frey: they would be yes at least early on. its seems a bit limiting though if forced to do that exclusively.
Frey listens
Black-Lotus: Since the art itself changes its information based on the user, you could use the same mechanics of the art to give a similar output.
Arnaya nods thoughtfully to Black-lotus
Black-Lotus: Which would be, if I am a DreamSeer, the first set of names would be of my focus, the rest would be of the other foci.
Frey: thats a good point..
Frey makes a note
Black-Lotus: That way, a student would know all of the available teachers, and specifically the ones that could help them the most.
Black-Lotus: As Arnaya said, all teachers can be of help... but early on it is good to have your own guide you into your first steps.
Arnaya nods in agreement
Frey: through the first sphere its very important yes.
Black-Lotus: Of course, if you can simply manage a locatable art that simply outputs the focus of each of the teachers... that is probably the best case.
Black-Lotus: I do have some questions though...
Frey: the vast majority of the population are veterans though. I suppose what i had planned would be to allow us to detect teachers we really wouldnt normally use, also.
Frey: a sort of universal benefit would be ideal. go ahead lotus
Black-Lotus: Is the expected output going to be similar to locate dreamer? For instance, if I was located on a separate plane, I would not be specifically locatable, moreso than the actual plane I was on.
Black-Lotus: Correct?
Frey: thats correct. i was thinking a lot more similar to locate than sense
Frey: you mentioned the other day that perhaps its detection would improve with plateau
Frey: giving more specific information.
Frey: but please contiunue
Frey: i have a question in the meantime. do any other arts improve as far as what they do, not counting strength or duration increases ?
Arnaya shakes her head to Frey
Frey: i mean for information gathering and whatnot. it seems judgement should do this.
Purple Lace: Doesn't Forge
Arnaya: Not that I know of anyway
Purple Lace: ?
Frey: Does it ?
Purple Lace: More items available
Purple Lace: ?
Arnaya: Not more items
Purple Lace: it used to.
Arnaya: just a wider variety of the same base set of functions
Purple Lace: Nay, I mean like rings or scrolls or boxes.
Arnaya shakes her head
Purple Lace: ok, it used to.
Black-Lotus: I don't believe that it did. The improvements on the art were mainly strength and charges that applied to them.
Arnaya: all of them are available right from unplatted now
Arnaya gestures to Black-Lotus, nodding
Black-Lotus: Rings and the like weren't available at all back in our dreams.
Black-Lotus: Not in the same way that they are now.
20:57:58: Purple Lace: when the Smiths get their Mark, they have added items available.
20:58:12: Arnaya: Wordsmiths as well, and house members
Purple Lace nods
Black-Lotus: I was a Smith for years, perhaps something changed after the Citys merged.
Arnaya: Its fairly new actually
Arnaya: Only a couple of months old
Purple Lace nods, agreeing with arnaya
Frey: so the detection of our focal arts is important. which would be more important if forced to choose though? i mean do we focus on making the focal arts a factor or just a simple translation of locate ? Showing us who's available and where ?
Black-Lotus: Okay, I suppose I was confused with "used to". I thought that was referring to the old dreams.
Frey: frankly i think the focus would be a great touch. but with just a little experience we learn who teaches our focus and who doesnt.
Purple Lace: Well, in the training area, ye are told to seek one of ye focus.
Purple Lace: that doesn't make it right, only what's there now.
Black-Lotus: Well, the main importance of your art over something like locate... is that locate requires knowledge of the target. So getting knowledge of teachers at all, without knowledge of the target is impressive.
Frey: the first teacher we find could inform us of our focal teachers
Arnaya: I'd personally suggest working more on the halo and colours than the focal arts.... I can kinda see the initial effort resulting a burst telling us everysingle person dreaming, and their focus if we used the focus arts
Arnaya giggles lightly
Black-Lotus: The focus is certainly something that would be helpful.
Frey: aye.. overload
Frey: agreed
Arnaya nods in agreement
Frey: I just worry that we're asking too much in the art
Frey: even without focus it would be very helpful. I'm not against the idea though
Purple Lace: what if ye went with something more basic....like detecting the Art of Quest, Train and/or Sphere?
Arnaya nods thoughtfully to Purple Lace
Frey: I'm definitely against the additional theory i need to come up with though
Frey chuckles
Purple Lace: Halos go on and off... the arts nay go away.
Frey: thats true
Purple Lace: Akkadian says he can see e'ery quest we create, so that ability exists.
Purple Lace: so the detection is already there.
Frey: and a good point. but that would leave teachers without the ability for privacy
Arnaya: Mind Blank
Arnaya shrugs lightly
Purple Lace: We lose that when ordained.
Arnaya gestures to Purple Lace
Purple Lace: Welcome to my world, Frey.
Frey: i understand
Purple Lace smirks at him
Frey: youre right of course
Black-Lotus: I don't think it's quite the loss of all privacy.
Frey: you see it from the eyes of a master teacher only though
Black-Lotus: We still take advantage of Mind Blank.
Purple Lace: True... but tis always been that way for me.
Frey: actually the privacy issue was brought up by you at one of the DS meetings early on
Purple Lace: True. Mind Blank should be a factor in ye process.
Frey: definitely
Frey: I think i need to rework this from the start and stop over complicating it
Arnaya: basing the art on Locate, means that's at least already partly built in
Frey: like you said some of the basics are in place
Purple Lace nods to arnaya
Frey: exactly
Arnaya: Even if some elements of sense were included, that's kind of a core part of Locate and Mind Blank
Purple Lace: Work with what ye have instead of trying to invent wheels here.
Frey: the problem is the filtering system
Frey: but the square wheel can WORK dangit
Arnaya laughs lightly
Frey shakes his fist exaggeratedly
Purple Lace: What about focal elemen levels
Purple Lace: could that be a factor?
Frey: possibly
Purple Lace: My Insight be higher than m'other levels, other than dreamsoul
Frey: basically ALL we need is a way to filter locate dreamer
Frey: which was the idea with using drain self originally
Arnaya nods lightly to Frey
Frey: teachers already show on locate. but without their names we wouldn't know it
Frey: so do we manually "teach" locate these names one at a time. which sound like a lot of work but possible.
Black-Lotus: Drain Self goes back to the idea of depending on the avatar and essence to determine the focus.
Frey: or condense a list even
Purple Lace: ok, sense shows someone in the Barrows and people here.
Black-Lotus: That won't help you much.
Frey: yeah im not all in for using drain self
Purple Lace: If a few filters were in place, that would narrow down who's in the barrows...if they were a teacher.
Purple Lace: Look at House Member art
Frey: if we could condense the list into a condensed formthough.. like make that list of teachers take up a single slot on our locate somehow
Purple Lace: it filters by house affiliation
Frey: one slot containing all the names
Purple Lace: Sense dreamer filters by number of dreamers in an area.
Frey: yes
Purple Lace: Sense Datoke filters by maren characteristics.
Purple Lace: but doesn't show DarkMares
Frey tilts his head and slaps the opposite side a few times to make room
Purple Lace: so sounds like ye just need to figure out the right filters.
Frey: its true
Frey: i wonder the mechanism by which they even do that
Purple Lace: Art of Quest and Focal filters sounds good to me.
Purple Lace: Akkadian might tell ye, but he'd have to kill ye afterwards.
Frey: its probably the best idea ive heard lace.
Purple Lace smirks
Black-Lotus: Newly Awakened, it is keying on something rather specific about individuals in the dream... no specific targeting knowledge required.
Black-Lotus: Rulers and Guardians still have the sense of the uninitiated, do they not?
Purple Lace: right... number of orbits with a max of 9. Good example, Lotus.
Purple Lace nods
Frey: but how do we as dreamers "train" locate to do that ? I cant even think of experiments to conduct.
Arnaya nods
Black-Lotus: That is all passive knoweldge without any actual targeting... but it is filtered specifically.
Frey nods
Black-Lotus: I think locate is probably not the one you want. Newly Awakened is probably closer to the mark. You simply want focus and halo, instead of orbits.
Black-Lotus: Master Lace is familiar with... massaging arts into something a bit different.
Frey: thats another good point
Black-Lotus: Her ideas of combining that with Quest is pretty spot in, in my opinion.
Frey: or a combination
Black-Lotus: As she stated, the Keeper of Keys already can track the art.
2Purple Lace: it would grab ye apprentices also... an added benefit for both new dreamer and new teacher.
Black-Lotus nods
Arnaya nods in agreement with Purple Lace
Frey: i can't argue
Black-Lotus: You should try.
Black-Lotus smiles.
Frey: so does anyone else have anything to add ?
Frey: how about this. we go with that at first and meet next to decide how to proceed from there
Arnaya: Sounds like things are pretty hammered out honestly
Frey: so whats the next step then
Frey: testing ?
Arnaya: well, next sounds like testing
Purple Lace nods
Arnaya grins lightly at Frey
Frey: its my weakest area of expertise so far
Frey points to a discarded mountain of notes in the water behind him
Purple Lace grins
Arnaya giggles
Purple Lace: Noone said making arts was easy, love.
Arnaya waves lightly to Dar'canon
Purple Lace: Evening, Dar.
Frey: so can we meet to decide on testing next then ?
Purple Lace: ok
Arnaya: I'd suggest simply trying to use Newly Awakened, and filter it through a teachers essence
Frey: sounds good. and thank you coraal and lace I learned a lot tonight. if you weren't here i'd be long gone and still thinking it was hopeless
Purple Lace: that may work.
Purple Lace: I have one i can bring
Arnaya: at least as a preliminary test
Coraal completes his notes and winks at Frey
Arnaya: Things can be refined and tweaked from there
Purple Lace: I have a Lu essence too... an apprentice essence may be of use.
rey: so I'll post a version of some of the more useful portions of tonight tomorrow on the archives and try to meet again wednesday
Purple Lace always has a Lu essence


That's where we stand now. I'll update everyone after the next meeting